Thursday, February 2, 2012

Edmund de Thweng 1280-1344

Edmund de Thweng
Birth
1280 Cornborough, Malton North Riding, Yorkshire, England
Death 15 Oct 1344 Cornborough, Malton, North Ride Yorkshire, England
Parents
John Thweng 1261 – 1330
Joan de Mauley 1275 – 1345
Spouse & Children
Isabel Constable 1280 – 1346
Marmeduke De Thweng 1300 – 1369
from ancestry.com

notes on Edmund de Thwenge
Sir Edmund de Thwenge
of Cornburgh, nr Sheriffhutton, and Southburn;
d.15 Oct 1344 Inq.p.m 15 Oct 1344;
bur at Sheriff Hutton, where his effigy in mail armour still exists in the north chapel.

Married to Isabel, dau. of Sir Robert Constable of F1amborough, and Katherine, dau of Peter, Lord Mauley; dower assigned 18 Oct. 1345 of lands in Cornbrough and Southburn; d. 1346; bur. at Flamborough. Inq.p.m. 21 July 1346

Previous threads have noted the identification in varied sources of Katherine, wife of Sir Robert le Constable of Flamborough, co. Yorks. (sometimes wrongly placed, but correctly he who d. aft 8 Dec 1336) as Katherine de Mauley, daughter of Piers de Mauley [of various generations]. In connection with this issue, I have noted the following details taken from the pedigree of Thwenge of Kilton:

Sir Marmaduke de Thweng = Lucy de Brusd. 1279 I____I I I IRobert I I Sir John de Thwenge, = Joan, dau. of Sir_______I I Knt., b. at Kilton 1261, I Robert de Mauley;I I a fugitive from justice I d. 13 July 1347.Sir Marmaduke I in 1293, and in 1294 I Inq.p.m. 21 July ______________I charged with the murder I 1347; orderd to I I I I of Roger Colstan, [etc.] I take into the King's d. 2 Dec. 1330. The I the lands late of escheator was ordered to I Joan, late the wife take into the King's hands I of John de Thwenge the lands lateof Sir John I de Thwenge, Knt. at I Cornburgh, given to him Iby his elder bro. Marmaduke I________________________I_____I I2 Margery Sir Edmund de Thwenge of Cornburgh, = Ralph de Neville, nr. Sheriffhutton, and Southburn;Lord of Coverham, d. d. 15 Oct. 1344. Inq.p.m. 11 Nov. 18 Apr. 1331; bur. 1344; bur. at Sheriff Hutton, where in Coverham abbey his effigy in mail armour still exists in the north chapel of Sir John de = 1 Alice, dau. = 2 Isabel, dau. of Sir Clavering & sole heir of Robert Constable of Walter de Helmesley, Flamborough, and who brought the Katherine, dau. of manor of Upper Peter, Lord Mauley;Hemsley to her dower assigned 18 Oct. husband in 1320 1345 of lands in Cornbrough and South-burn; d. 1346; bur.at Flamborough. Inq.p.m. 21 July 1346

Interestingly, while the pedigrees for the Thwenges of Kilton and their cadets (pp. 371-385) are based in part on Visitation pedigrees, the notes to same indicate many other reliable primary and secondary sources used in their compilation, including VCH (Yorkshire), Testamenta Eboracensia, Yorkshire Inquisitions and others (some of which are cited, if incompletely, in the pedigrees as shown above) [2].

The foregoing works well with the separate record I noted in the Constable pedigree (Foster's) which states, without attribution, ' Robert Constable, was of Flamborough, calls Sir Marmaduke Thwenge his uncle 1319, and Edward Thwenge, of Cornburgh, his cousin. ' [3]

The chronology of the career of this Sir Robert le Constable [4], and of the de Mauley family (as can best be determined) indicates the following conjectural chart, now enhanced with the details given in the HSP Yorkshire pedigrees:
1) Joan de = Piers de Mauley = 2) NNBrus b. aft 24 May 1221 Id. bef 15 Jul 1279 I_______________________I_____I IPiers de Mauley = bef 1274 Nichole Sir Robert b. 22 Jul 1249 I de Gant de Mauleyd. 6 Sept 1308 I (cf. CP VIII:561________________I .... note (f)I . I I . IPiers de Mauley Katherine = Sir ROBERT Joan = Sir Johnb. 10 Mar 1280/ de Mauley I Constable I de Thweng1281 d. bef 19 I d. aft 8 Dec I b. 1261d. aft 23 May Mar 1376 I 1336 I d. 2 Dec1348 I I 1330___________________I_____ II I I I I ISir Marmaduke Isabel = Sir EDMUND de Thwengd. 1 Jun 1378 d. 15 Oct 1344
The foregoing would provide a relationship (or relationships) between Sir Robert le Constable and Sir Edmund (not Edward) de Thwenge of Cornburgh, consistant with those shown in the Thweng pedigree cited above, and with the statements give by Foster that Sir Robert le Constable had called "Edward" Thwenge of Cornburgh his cousin (if only by marriage).
The probable descent of Sir Robert le Constable himself from the de Thwengs of Kilton has not yet been resolved, although hinted at by Foster as shown above. Perhaps the IPMs cited in HSP 96:376-7 for Joan (de Mauley) de Thweng, dated 21 July 1347, and for Isabel (le Constable) de Thweng, dated 21 July 1346, will provide further proof, or additional details for research.
Cheers,
John *
[2] HSP 96:385 gives the following at the end of the Thwenge pedigrees:
" Authorities: Glover's Visitation, 1584-5; St. George's, 1612; Radclyffe, Brack, 1735; Vic. County Hist. of Yorks., N.R., vol. II; Test. Ebor.; Wills in the York Registry (Yorks. Arch. Soc.); Yorks. Arch. Journal; W. Hebditch, M.A.; Guisborough Chartulary, Fasti Eboracenses, Yorks. Inquisitions (Y.A.S.); Feet of Fines (Y.A.S.); Chronicles of Melsa Abbey, Fountain's Chartulary, Bridlington Chartulary, Close Rolls, Patent Rolls, Charter Rolls. "
[3] Foster, Pedigrees of the County Families of Yorkshire: Constable of Burton Constable.
[4] The following reflects the documentation I have to hand concerning Sir Robert le Constable:
Sir Robert le Constable----------------------------------------d. after 8 Dec 1336 [8]
knt., of Flamborough, co. Yorks. summoned to serve in Scotland, 24 June 1300; knighted 22 May 1306 together with Edward (II), Prince of Wales[10]
' On 15 Feb. 1312, he was sumd, as Robt. s. of Wm le Constable, to appear before the Kg at York to treat on arduous affairs, and on 24 June foll. under the style of Robt Constable, jun., was ord. to go to Stamford Bridge with horse and arms.' [YAS XCI:51[12]]
' Robert Constable, was of Flamborough, calls Sir Marmaduke Thwenge his uncle 1319, and Edward Thwenge, of Cornburgh, his cousin. ' [Foster, pedigree of Constable of Burton Constable[13] ; cf. J. Ravilious, [14]]
' Robert Constable ', enfeoffed Aymer de Valence in his purparty related to the church of Foston on the Wolds, ref. to a dispute concerning same in 1334 [in the text of the case, ' the Constable descent is definitely given from the same Eufemia, being the mother of William Constable (one of the coheirs in 1221), the father of Robert Constable, father of William Constable (of the 1290-1 case), father of Robert Constable who enfeoffed Aymer de Valence of his purparty.' - EYC XII:144-5, cites EYC XI:198, and Genealogist, N.S., ix, 9[3]
' Sir Robert le Conestable of Fleynburgh', witness to gift by his cousin William de Houton in dower on marriage, dated at Pykerings, Mon. after St. Peter ad vincula 6 Ed.III. (3 Aug. 1332):' William de Houton to his wife Joan daughter of Sir Geoffrey de St.Quintin property: messuage & 5 oxgangs in Wigthun. Toft & 5 oxgangs in Hougat. 10 tofts & crofts, 3½ oxgangs & 2ac. in Wartre.Toft & 6 oxgangs in Repplingham. Toft & 2 oxgangs in Beleby.Messuage & dovecote in Santon. 2 tofts & ½ oxgang in Bubwith.Rent of 6s.8d. in Hygthe. Witn. Sir Robert le Conestable of Fleynburgh, Sir William Bronys, Sir Roger de Grimyston, Richard de Santon, Thomas de Hundgat of Brunby. ' - A2A, East Riding of Yorkshire Archives and Records Service: Chichester-Constable Family [DDCC/136 - DDCC2/G] - PEDIGREES AND GENEALOGICAL MATERIAL - DDCC/149/26/Bb9a[8])
the next evidently refers to the same Robert le Constable:quitclaim dated 8 Dec. 1336:' Adam de Kelk of Bridlington to Roger son of Sir Robert de Bonyngton, property: all suits and claims Witn. Sir Roger de Sumervil, Sir Robert le Conestable, Sir John de Hastorp, Sir William de Herechome, Sir George Salvayne, William de Bucton, John de Speton, John de Carthorp Robert Randolf de Kilham, Thomas de Bedale. Given at Bridlington.' - A2A, East Riding of Yorkshire Archives and Records Service: Chichester-Constable Family [DDCC/111 - DDCC/135], DDCC/135/5a[8]
' Robert, William and Marmaduke Conestable ', named (together with his sons) as one of the 'relatives of the said Thomas [de Thweng]' in his gift to Kirkleatham priory, 31 May 1348 [Inspeximus and confirmation of letters patent of William, late archbishop of York, dated in Cawode manor, 31 May, 1348, ordaining, on the petition of Thomas de Thweng, rector and patron of the church of Lythom, dated 33 Edward III - Part III, m. 22 1359 Oct. 6. Westminster - Calendar of Patent Rolls 1358-61, pp. 287, 288, courtesy Chris Phillips[14]]
cf. Knights I:233[10]YAS XCI:50-51 [sub _Robert le Constable of Flamborough_[12]]
sources for the above:
3. William Farrer, Hon.D.Litt., Editor, "Early Yorkshire Charters,"Ballantyne, Hanson & Co., Edinburgh, 1915-1916, Vol. II (1915)Vol. III (1916), Vol. XII [the family of Constable of Flamborough], courtesy Rosie Bevan.4. J. C. B. Sharp, "Constable Connections!," Sept 15, 2000,GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com, citing C. T. Clay, Early YorkshireCharters, xii, pp. 142-151.5. Charles Roberts, ed., "Excerpta ex Rotulis Finium," The Commissioners of the Public Records of the Kingdom, Vol I (1216-1246), 1835, full title: Excerpta e Rotulis Finium in Turri Londinensi asservatis, Henrico Tertio Rege, A.D. 1216-1272.6. The Rev. J. T. Fowler, M.A., F.S.A., "The Coucher Book of Selby [Cartularium Abbathiae S. Germani de Seleby]," The Yorkshire Archaeological and Topographical Association, Record Series, Vol. II (Record series vol. XIII) - 1893.7. John Nichols, F.S.A., "The History and Antiquities of the County of Leicester," London: Printed By and For John Nichols, 1795,Vol. I, Appendix XIII: Chartulary of the Honour of Segrave, p. 119, charters of Thomas de Birkin, William de Flamborough andNicholas de Anesty, of lands in Pickwell and Leesthorpe, co. Leics. to Stephen de Segrave, Vol. II, Pt. II (Gartre Hundred), p. 488 re: grant of 'Boggeden' and Haverburgh to William de Cantelou, 1237;, pp. 531 et seq., Burton Overy (family of Hugh de Meinill), p. 768 et seq., manors of Pickwell and Leesthorpe (Camville and Curzon), Vol. III, Pt. I (East Gascote Hundred)- 1800; p. 62 et seq., Barrow;, pp. 301 et seq., Launde priory; pp. 332 et seq., Whadborough (charters of Fulk Fitz Warin and family), pp. 353 et seq., Prestwould; pp. 363 et seq., Burton on the Wolds.8. "Access to Archives," http://www.a2a.pro.gov.uk/9. John P. Ravilious, "Re: Magister Roger de Arundel and the Birkins of Laxton, co. Notts.," April 18, 2003,GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com, cites charter of John de Birkin, Joan his wife and Dionisia (her sister) widow of William deGlanville, to monks of Watton (Records of the Anglo-Norman House of Glanville,, text at http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jglanville/roanhg2.htm also fine of 19 June 1221 by Thomas de Birkin, Nicholas deAnesty and Thomas de 'Hothu', as heirs of 'Magister Roger de Arundel', Excerpta e Rotulis Finium in Turri Londinensi asservatis ,, Henrico Tertio Rege, A.D. 1216-1272, p.66. 10. Rev. Charles Moor, D.D., F.S.A., "Knights of Edward I," Pubs. of the Harleian Society, 1929-1930, 3 Vols. (Vols. 80-83 in series).11. "Testamenta Eboracensia [Selection of Wills, Reg. at York]," The Surtees Society, Andrews & Co., Durham (J. B. Nichols &Sons, London), Vol. IV, Pt. I: 1869, IV:50-52, will of Isabella Deincourt (wife of Sir William fitz William) d. 1348, IV:97-99,will of Marmaduke Constable (d. 1378), see pp. 100-101 for will of Sir Martin de la See, IV:418-419, will of Isabella Salvayn.12. A. Gooder, Ph.D., "The Parliamentary Representation of the County of York, 1258-1832, Vol. I," The Yorkshire Archaeological Society, Record Series, Vol. XCI (1935), Wakefield: Printed for the Society, 1935.13. "Pedigrees of the County Families of Yorkshire," compiled by Joseph Foster, W. Wilfred Head, London, 2 vols.: 1874. 14. John P. Ravilious, "Constable Connection: the Lords Thweng," 8 January 2005, therav3@aol.com, cites Inspeximus and confirmation of letters patent of William, late archbishop of York, dated in Cawode manor, 31 May, 1348 [Calendar of Patent Rolls 1358-61, pp. 287-288], and Joseph Foster, Pedigrees of the County Families of Yorkshire (London: W. Wilfred Head, 1874), vol. II, pedigree of Constable of Burton Constable. * John P. Ravilious
from ancestry.com

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